Can you explain the purpose of Freedom to Fly?

Baroness Dean:Freedom to Fly is a very broad coalition made up of not just the aviation industry but tourism, air users and business generally and all the trade unions too. We are working to try and make sure the promise of a white paper on aviation capacity for the next 30 years is one the government follows through.

We want to see a white paper because it's been over 20 years since we last had a national debate about aviation and this is a once in a generation opportunity. What we don't want with aviation is to end up like the rail industry in the past with no overall framework therefore no long term investment plans and you end up in gridlock. Already many of our large airports are already bumping up against their capacity so we do need expansions.

What the coalition is not saying is where the expansion should be. That's not our job that's the government's job. What is clear though is what you need is at least three extra runways in the south east -that's what the figures are indicating. And you need at least one international hub which is currently Heathrow. We need to make sure we have an international hub because we're an island and we depend on global trade.

What is your role at Freedom to Fly?

Baroness Dean:I am chairman of Freedom to Fly. I was approached to chair it and my reaction at first was to be a bit surprised because I don't work in the aviation industry. Like most people I use it for holidays and for visiting family and friends. They said that this is such a broad coalition that we don't want someone from the aviation sector because its not just us as an industry, its about UK plc.

The more I looked into it, I realised that this really is one of the new successful big sectors in the UK. Its an industry which has replaced the older industries like ship building, steel and coal industry which were really big employers. About half a million people in the UK depend on aviation directly or indirectly for their jobs. And there are another million people employed in tourism .

So this is a big job creator, it's a new industry and its one that's a very strong wealth creator, so from my background in the trade unions and manufacturing industry, that's why I'm interested.

How does the UK's airport infrastructure compare to that of other countries?

Baroness Dean:Well we're still very successful at it compared to other countries - there's no doubt about that. After all, its 50 years this year since the first commercial Comet took off and I think it's very much with this heritage in mind that we're looking forward to the white paper.

Heathrow in particular has been very successful but look at the regions as well. This coalition is not just about London and the South East - it's about the regions as well. People want to travel from the nearest airport to their home, if possible. Manchester and Birmingham for example are terrifically successful, or the East Midlands in freight -so much of our exports after all depend on aviation.

But if you also look at the continent, they've been creeping up. Schipol Airport in Amsterdam has really taken off as a commercial airport. Now it's got five runways and has been building year on year. In the UK, we've only got two commercial airports with two runways - Manchester and Heathrow - whereas Charles de Gaulle in Paris has built two new runways in the last four years. Frankfurt has also developed enormously. So we are starting to lag behind. You can't just go and create extra capacity in a year - it's a long-term process.

Does the government have a good understanding of the aviation sector?

Baroness Dean:I think that Alastair Darling is certainly on top of his brief. When he made the announcement publishing the consultation document in July, he said "doing nothing isn't an option." He also said that aviation is crucial to our economy and our jobs, so he is absolutely right there.

I think they do understand the importance of it. Remember we are an island, and a rather small island at that and so we have to make sure we get this sector right. But there's no doubt that this is one of the most difficult decisions that any government could take. It's not going to be very popular with everyone - whatever decision they reach is going to cause a reaction and lead to reactions. But this nettle needs to be grasped.

Otherwise jobs will be affected - even the consultation paper warns that if we don't do anything, the Government says it will put £100 on a return air ticket and could cost the economy £15 billion. This will start to close down people's options. Over the past 20 years, aviation has gone from being a luxury mode of transport to one which is open to all of us. And , critically for the UK, this will start to affect jobs, there's no doubt about that.

Baroness Dean:How would you convince people living under the flight path of the need for greater capacity?

Heathrow 20 years ago had about three million people affected by noise, particularly by noisier older planes such as the DC10 and the DC1-11. Today that's reduced to 300,000 and planes are quieter. Everyone has got to accept that if you live near an airport, you're going to be troubled by noise.

With the debate at the moment on aviation. But you know building new railway lines or roads leads to the same kind of opposition as you get to new airports - remember the Channel Tunnel Rail Link.

There is a general consensus that we need expansion but everybody says in someone else's back yard and not in ours. So what you've got to try and do is mitigate the impact as much as you can. The local environment is critical - technology is a way of keeping noise down. We now have much quieter planes and the sector is working hard to reduce this even more. An efficient air traffic control will also stop plans stacking so much which mean less noise as well.

There is also the issue of compensation. Sometimes - as we found with the Channel Tunnel Rail Link which everyone now welcomes - you just have to pay compensation to people because there's no other way of doing it.

Does the example of the T5 Planning Inquiry at Heathrow suggest to you that the government needs to reform the planning system?

Baroness Dean:Well this issue comes under the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister, and planning is critical. I think everyone - even the opponents of Terminal 5 - would all agree that fifteen years from beginning to end is no way of planning something that has a direct impact on our economy. So there has to be a much more efficient way of doing it.

People want to know what the decisions are going to be so that they can plan their lives. After all, even now, they haven't started building yet, they're still going through local planning regulations. We just want them to get on with it.

When that extra terminal is done, that could actually help reduce noise levels too, in the sense that they'll have somewhere to bring the planes down and park them. There's no doubt that the new air traffic control system is a better system than what they had before - it's just with new computers you always get glitches. They are also short of staff - which they should have managed better - but nevertheless, when they get it sorted, it's going to be a really efficient system. So this coupled with the extra terminal should considerably improve the local environment.

What do you think about the transport links between airports and cities in the UK?

Everyone says that the Heathrow to Paddington link is great, but it is expensive - particularly if you've got a family. All the rail unions and the rail industry our supporting our coalition because it's quite clear that you need to have an integrated transport policy, with better rail links to airports for example.. The Strategic Rail Authority plan only looks ten years ahead, whereas we're looking 30 years ahead.

The Stansted link is being upgraded - it's going to be painful for the next 18 months but we do need a better rail link. Another example is when I come in to Heathrow and want to go down to the West Country I have to get a bus to Reading. I've missed the last train on more than one occasion because of traffic on the motorway. What you want to do is to go to your final destination direct from the airport - wherever you are going - rather than having to come back into London first.

We're very keen that the surface access is improved. At the moment about a third of passengers travel by public transport to our major airports. Manchester has improved tremendously over the past few years through their new train link and the tram is to be extended too. But we certainly we need to get this figure up. Compared with Europe it's good, but if you want to help the environment then you need to improve the bus and rail links.

There are some European measures affecting air quality. Meeting this will certainly help the situation around Heathrow. You can't just carry on building car park after car park. What you do need to do to get the public using public transport by making the journey easy for them. For example enough space on the train for their luggage and make it at a decent price.